Should DS be nerfed

Написано Darth., 08.05.2016 at 21:59

Написано ROYAL, 08.05.2016 at 21:45

Написано Darth., 08.05.2016 at 21:41

Написано ROYAL, 08.05.2016 at 21:35

Написано Darth., 08.05.2016 at 21:31

DS is not OP. It needs to be cost effective while expanding and the like, since its very expensive. 130 cost Helis and equally expensive Marines would have you going bankrupt if not for the bonus against militias and Infantry.
Its efficient against PD, and underpowered against Imp, another popular strat

You literally have no idea what you are talking about.

Underpowered against imp? you got to be kidding right?
It is the most cost efficient and reinforcement efficient strat when it comes to expanding.
You think 130 cost helies are expensive? SM bombers, Regular tanks, mos marines cost equally the same. The big difference is that Helies are much much much more efficient at expanding and they can carry a marine to capture.

And that marine also costs 130, which is why it's expensive. MoS you need to buy only 130 cost Marines. SM you can use cheap infantry to capture with maybe one or two chained ATs. DS you need both 130 cost Helis, and 130 cost Marines.
Also, I'm not saying DS is useless against Imp, I'm not saying you can't use it, what I'm saying is, compared to its performance against PD, it is underwhelming against Imp because tanks are pretty cheap.

Also, stop judging me based on my rank. I'm speaking from experience here when I say DS isn't as effective against Imp.

Lets see the bare minimum needed for sm or ds to capture a 8 infantry capital that can't be reached in one turn by ground troops

DS
6 helies x 130 = 780
1 marine = 130
Total = 910

SM
9 Bombers x 130 = 1170
air trans + 1 MILITIA = 430
Total 1600

I'm not judging you by your rank, I'm judging you by your elo, your relative inexperience in the game, your win rate (279 (won 85))

And that AT can be reused again and again. It's a onetime purchase kinda like lifetime premium. It's cheaper in the long run. So 1600-600=1000
Also you can get by with 8 bombers so that knocks 130 off the cost. 1000-130=870
You need 7 helis since it's easy to fail with 6 so that adds 130 cost. 910+130=1040

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Ds you have to keep replacing dead helis and Marines while in SM, out of 8 bombers and 1 inf/militia you send, I've found that between 5-6 bombers will be left over. Helis die a lot more, and thus DS becomes slightly more expensive, which is why since it has less range, it needs that bonus against inf and militia.

---

Also, I've technically played less than 200 games. The rest are training matches. Both for my practice as well as me training a couple of lower ranks. Forgive me sensei, for being so helpful

---

My low ELO is from a single duel with 1godofwar1. I got my ass kicked

Написано ROYAL, 08.05.2016 at 22:03

Написано Darth., 08.05.2016 at 21:59

Написано ROYAL, 08.05.2016 at 21:45

Написано Darth., 08.05.2016 at 21:41

Написано ROYAL, 08.05.2016 at 21:35

Написано Darth., 08.05.2016 at 21:31

DS is not OP. It needs to be cost effective while expanding and the like, since its very expensive. 130 cost Helis and equally expensive Marines would have you going bankrupt if not for the bonus against militias and Infantry.
Its efficient against PD, and underpowered against Imp, another popular strat

You literally have no idea what you are talking about.

Underpowered against imp? you got to be kidding right?
It is the most cost efficient and reinforcement efficient strat when it comes to expanding.
You think 130 cost helies are expensive? SM bombers, Regular tanks, mos marines cost equally the same. The big difference is that Helies are much much much more efficient at expanding and they can carry a marine to capture.

And that marine also costs 130, which is why it's expensive. MoS you need to buy only 130 cost Marines. SM you can use cheap infantry to capture with maybe one or two chained ATs. DS you need both 130 cost Helis, and 130 cost Marines.
Also, I'm not saying DS is useless against Imp, I'm not saying you can't use it, what I'm saying is, compared to its performance against PD, it is underwhelming against Imp because tanks are pretty cheap.

Also, stop judging me based on my rank. I'm speaking from experience here when I say DS isn't as effective against Imp.

Lets see the bare minimum needed for sm or ds to capture a 8 infantry capital that can't be reached in one turn by ground troops

DS
6 helies x 130 = 780
1 marine = 130
Total = 910

SM
9 Bombers x 130 = 1170
air trans + 1 MILITIA = 430
Total 1600

I'm not judging you by your rank, I'm judging you by your elo, your relative inexperience in the game, your win rate (279 (won 85))

And that AT can be reused again and again. It's a onetime purchase kinda like lifetime premium. It's cheaper in the long run. So 1600-600=1000
Also you can get by with 8 bombers so that knocks 130 off the cost. 1000-130=870
You need 7 helis since it's easy to fail with 6 so that adds 130 cost. 910+130=1040

---

Ds you have to keep replacing dead helis and Marines while in SM, out of 8 bombers and 1 inf/militia you send, I've found that between 5-6 bombers will be left over. Helis die a lot more, and thus DS becomes slightly more expensive, which is why since it has less range, it needs that bonus against inf and militia.

---

Also, I've technically played less than 200 games. The rest are training matches. Both for my practice as well as me training a couple of lower ranks. Forgive me sensei, for being so helpful

---

My low ELO is from a single duel with 1godofwar1. I got my ass kicked

The marine doesn't die, you can reuse it over and over again.

Also , 6 helies 1 marine does fine vs moscow. You can throw in a 7th heli and it will almost never fail and it equal cost of 8 bomber + 1 inf/militia

HOWEVER 8 bomber and 1 militia/inf WILL FAIL MOSCOW A LOT. <<<---- A LOT!!!!!!

Also, if you sent 7 DS helies and 1 Marine so it's equal the cost of 8 bombers and 1 militia/inf, you will ALSO FIND that DS loses less units.

Цитировать:

Написано Darth., 08.05.2016 at 21:31

I've failed many times with 6 helis and 1 marine.
Also, you have a while lot of free infantry and militia just lying around. Infantry when you start the game, militia when you capture cities. Use 2/3 free infantry, or 5 free militia with 7/8 bombers instead of a single unit

I use a single AT for sending inf to both St. Petersburg and RC so that drastically cuts the price. 2 inf to Petersburg and 3 to RC. 8 bombers to RC and 8/9 to Petersburg.

Написано Darth., 08.05.2016 at 22:12

And the marine does die sometimes. My helis will kill everything in a city, but won't capture it cuz in the middle of the Battle the marine died (as shown by the battle screen)

Цитировать:

Написано ROYAL, 08.05.2016 at 22:17

Написано Darth., 08.05.2016 at 21:31

I've failed many times with 6 helis and 1 marine.
Also, you have a while lot of free infantry and militia just lying around. Infantry when you start the game, militia when you capture cities. Use 2/3 free infantry, or 5 free militia with 7/8 bombers instead of a single unit

I use a single AT for sending inf to both St. Petersburg and RC so that drastically cuts the price. 2 inf to Petersburg and 3 to RC. 8 bombers to RC and 8/9 to Petersburg.

So you changed it from 8 bomber 1 inf to 8 bombers 3 inf now.

Lets assume we both take RNW and RC


=============================
DS
Moscow
6 helies x 130 = 780
1 marine = 130

Saint Peter
Gen + 10 inf = Free starting inf
Air trans = 550

Total = 1460
================================
SM
Moscow
8 Bombers = 1040
3 Inf + air trans = 400 (inf free)

Saint Peter
7 Inf + gen = Free
2 Bombers = 260

Total = 1700
====================================

Nope still lose.

Написано Darth., 08.05.2016 at 22:12

And the marine does die sometimes. My helis will kill everything in a city, but won't capture it cuz in the middle of the Battle the marine died (as shown by the battle screen)

The only way marine will die is if all helies die first or a bug happened.
Or you are in a confrontation vs another enemy over a neutral country.

Написано Permamuted, 08.05.2016 at 19:10

Написано JADRAN., 08.05.2016 at 18:32

Написано Sun Tsu, 08.05.2016 at 18:29

Написано JADRAN., 08.05.2016 at 18:18

Написано Sun Tsu, 08.05.2016 at 18:13

Use anti-aircraft...

AA is a joke. If you ever used AA you would know that AA vs SM bombers for instance does nothing. I've seen some pretty horrible rolls with bombers/helis vs AA.

1 AA can take out up to 7 helis, try it.

Lol in what world. I always use AA against helis/sm bombers, especially when I know a rush is coming. I have upgraded AA, and never have I had rolls such as that. 1 bomber usually will kill 1 AA

stacking effect is your friend. i had 4 aa kill over 20 helis once, it was 23 helis and a marine vs 40 inf 4 aa. However if you get outstacked then yea the aa wont be very effective.

Написано Darth., 09.05.2016 at 01:03

Oh piss off

Написано minusSeven, 09.05.2016 at 13:37

DS isn't an OP strat. not even close. The -1 inf more than makes up for OP helis. Also even now SM and MOS is a very good counter for DS in world games. So it makes no sense to make it nerfed.

Написано Kraigg, 09.05.2016 at 04:41

However in narb games such as 25/50K, DS is indeed OP as fuck

Написано Permamuted, 09.05.2016 at 15:28

Написано Kraigg, 09.05.2016 at 04:41

However in narb games such as 25/50K, DS is indeed OP as fuck

sm and mos wreck it, particularly sm.

Написано EndsOfInvention, 09.05.2016 at 15:04

Arguing about which of SM or DS has a slightly more efficient taking of moscow is hardly a valid way to compare two strats overall for effectiveness.

Along with it's greater rang and maneuverability, SM has a sheer defensive velocity that DS could never match, forcing it onto the highly offensive edge of the spectrum, with all the severe weaknesses that entails.

Написано Kraigg, 09.05.2016 at 04:41

However in narb games such as 25/50K, DS is indeed OP as fuck

Написано Cold Case, 09.05.2016 at 15:40

Написано Kraigg, 09.05.2016 at 04:41

However in narb games such as 25/50K, DS is indeed OP as fuck

You kind sir are very very wrong.This is answered by laochra above me.

This is answered by me:DS in World Map is only good for 5k,where most ppl use inf to expand or to stack so yes DS there is the best.

This is final results from a World 5k someone hosted and I as USA vs 3 ppl won with DS and then built stack to beat eu who was waltz i think,he had one enormous stack of inf with gen moved to birm the same turn i hit uk and killed his gen too and all those sp won me the game.Hdra was asia.Fun game.



This is how the world looked:



PS:Enigma memories

Написано Kraigg, 09.05.2016 at 15:53

... so in order to prove I am wrong that DS is good in 50K u show us it is very good in 5K...

I quite don't understand the reasoning here...

Написано Cold Case, 09.05.2016 at 15:57

Написано Kraigg, 09.05.2016 at 15:53

... so in order to prove I am wrong that DS is good in 50K u show us it is very good in 5K...

I quite don't understand the reasoning here...

In 5k most people go smth that produces mostly inf,they rarely go gw,mos,ds or sm like I like to do.

After winning their own battles they have to build stacks with what?inf exactly and here is where ds comes.

Написано Kraigg, 09.05.2016 at 15:34

Написано Permamuted, 09.05.2016 at 15:28

Написано Kraigg, 09.05.2016 at 04:41

However in narb games such as 25/50K, DS is indeed OP as fuck

sm and mos wreck it, particularly sm.

I think u assume I am talking about world 25/50K, but I am not. I am convinced DS in Eur 50K is far better than SM or MOS, try it sometimes Lao

Написано Kraigg, 09.05.2016 at 15:34

Написано Permamuted, 09.05.2016 at 15:28

Написано Kraigg, 09.05.2016 at 04:41

However in narb games such as 25/50K, DS is indeed OP as fuck

sm and mos wreck it, particularly sm.

I think u assume I am talking about world 25/50K, but I am not. I am convinced DS in Eur 50K is far better than SM or MOS, try it sometimes Lao

Написано clovis1122, 08.05.2016 at 16:52

Написано JADRAN., 08.05.2016 at 16:42

(leaving pd inf with just 5 def in cities; this is equal to blitz infantry).

Blitz infantries have 4 defense in cities.... hence why several complains about it.

For me DS is just fine. I think that comparing it against a single strategy is wrong by the way.

Написано Kraigg, 09.05.2016 at 15:34

Написано Permamuted, 09.05.2016 at 15:28

Написано Kraigg, 09.05.2016 at 04:41

However in narb games such as 25/50K, DS is indeed OP as fuck

sm and mos wreck it, particularly sm.

I think u assume I am talking about world 25/50K, but I am not. I am convinced DS in Eur 50K is far better than SM or MOS, try it sometimes Lao

Написано Nations, 10.05.2016 at 11:29

STOP BITCHING STOP ACCUSING STRATS OF BEING OP BECAUSE YOU CANT FIND A WAY TO BEAT THE STRATEGY.FFS.KEEP THIS UP AND THE ONLY STRAT THAT WILL BE VIABLE WILL BE PD.

Написано ROYAL, 10.05.2016 at 11:39

Написано Nations, 10.05.2016 at 11:29

STOP BITCHING STOP ACCUSING STRATS OF BEING OP BECAUSE YOU CANT FIND A WAY TO BEAT THE STRATEGY.FFS.KEEP THIS UP AND THE ONLY STRAT THAT WILL BE VIABLE WILL BE PD.

You mean like cancer walling your DS ukraine?

Написано clovis1122, 08.05.2016 at 21:57

Написано ROYAL, 08.05.2016 at 21:47

GW marines = 10 cost per 1 att

Imp militia = 5 cost per 1 att

DS helis ~ 13 cost per 1 att (against infantries only).

EDIT: What you're naming here is just one specific case.

Написано Cold Case, 09.05.2016 at 15:40

Написано Kraigg, 09.05.2016 at 04:41

However in narb games such as 25/50K, DS is indeed OP as fuck

You kind sir are very very wrong.This is answered by laochra above me.

This is answered by me:DS in World Map is only good for 5k,where most ppl use inf to expand or to stack so yes DS there is the best.

This is final results from a World 5k someone hosted and I as USA vs 3 ppl won with DS and then built stack to beat eu who was waltz i think,he had one enormous stack of inf with gen moved to birm the same turn i hit uk and killed his gen too and all those sp won me the game.Hdra was asia.Fun game.



This is how the world looked:



PS:Enigma memories